Episode 11: Tips for Handling Sales Objections with Dale Dupree
Our episode today covers one of our favorite topics: tips and advice for handling sales objections. When it comes to sales objections, many of us have been taught to view it as an obstacle that needs to be avoided and overcome by any means necessary.
Our guest today is here to offer an alternative perspective, that prioritizes the buyer and uses a servant leadership mindset to prioritize the needs of the customer. Dale Dupree, who many of us first got to know as the Copier Warrior, is an exceptional individual who is revolutionizing the status quo in the world of sales and sales training through his philosophy of servant leadership. Dale is the leader and founder of The Sales Rebellion, which he established after recognizing crucial deficiencies in how the majority of gurus were teaching sales in the 21st century. The Sales Rebellion provides sales training and development that challenges the status quo and prepares sellers for how the world of selling has changed and continues to evolve. In our conversation with Dale, we get to know him a bit better and hear how he first got into sales.
Dale shares some of the biggest challenges he’s faced since establishing The Sales Rebellion and what he has learned from them. We hear from Dale about how his dad influenced his career in sales and why his father is the embodiment of servant leadership. Dale delves into the concept of servant leadership and why it is integral to his sales approach and forms the foundation of The Sales Rebellion. Later we discuss some of the many misconceptions around sales objections and why it can be a valuable learning opportunity, building rapport, and establishing relationships. For all this and much more, tune in today!
Key Points From This Episode:
“I think that there's a real big gap in the sales world right now in regards to what the gurus and the top dogs are teaching, as opposed to what the salespeople of the 21st century need to be learning. Because I was in that world, I hired trainers, I hired them for my teams for myself.” — @SalesRebellion [0:03:54]
“I just kind of watched this dismal performance by the sales training world and thought, Man, we could really shake this up.” — @SalesRebellion [0:04:12]
“And really, the only thing that truly has shifted is just the opportunities to be able to take advantage of the outlets and mediums to get in touch with people or to build relationships or to create community.” — @SalesRebellion [0:10:33]
“Over time, your reputation will precede itself, no matter what you did behind those closed doors, someone will know it was you at one point.” — @SalesRebellion [0:12:10]
“We have a very short window on this earth, and salespeople have a unique opportunity to be able to impact lives, change lives for the betterment of society, and culture and community. And yet, all we do is focus on the transaction more so than anything.” — @SalesRebellion [0:12:36]
“The word objections inside of sales is also a dirty word. Well, a seller has got to learn to embrace them and be extremely proactive around them, or they're never going to get better.” — @SalesRebellion [0:20:05]
“So, again, I think it's this bigger picture perspective of how do we look at a lot of the things that have worked in the past and also understand what's missing there?” — @SalesRebellion [0:34:16]
“You're doing everything exactly the way it needs to be delivered to this person. And because of that, it's coming up as the best ‘no’ that you ever got.” — @SalesRebellion [0:40:40]
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:
Speaker 0 00:00:01 Coming to you from Orlando, Florida, Orlando, Florida, and streaming around the world around the world. You're not tuned in to the sales samurai podcast. The only B2B sales podcast, providing unfiltered unapologetic views and tactics directly from the sales trenches. Here's your host, Sam Capra.
Speaker 1 00:00:30 Welcome to episode 11 of the sales samurai. I'm your host, Sam Capra. Thank you so much for listening. Before we begin, do us a favor, take a moment to subscribe and download on today's show. We're going to be discussing a fan favorite tips for handling sales objections. And I have a phenomenal guest for you guys to help me really tackle that subject. Mr. Dale Dupree was once known as the copier warrior and is the appointed leader and founder of the sales rebellion, which provides sales, training, and development. That really challenges the sales status quo. You may know where I've seen Dale on stage or come across the variety of posts that he does on LinkedIn, where he is widely regarded as a top sales influencer. Dale man, welcome to the show brother.
Speaker 2 00:01:18 Thanks for having me on Sam. I really appreciate being here.
Speaker 1 00:01:20 No, man. It's an absolute pleasure. Hope you had a great 4th of July, by the
Speaker 2 00:01:23 Way. Yeah, it was awesome. There. My neighborhood loves fireworks, so they were going off all night, baby. Good
Speaker 1 00:01:30 Man. Yeah, our dog struggled through the night. I don't think she's stopped hiding a Nora blanket the entire night.
Speaker 2 00:01:36 Now that's sad. You know, my dad usually does pretty bad to one of my dogs, but she actually was pretty good for the first time and her seven year existence in life. So it was interesting. Well, good
Speaker 1 00:01:49 Man. So just for the, for the audience, and I know a lot of our owners already know who you are, give them a little context. Tell us a little bit about Dale, a little bit about the sales rebellion, which you know, I know a lot of the audience is obviously interested in. It's kind of give us a little background if you don't mind Dale.
Speaker 2 00:02:03 Yeah. I'll give you the highlights. What people need to know about me is that I was born and raised by a man that sold copiers for most of his existence because he blew out his knees in college, playing football on his way to the NFL. And so his plan B was sales, but that man also struggled tremendously through life. He battled alcoholism, lots of little things and came out on top hardcore on top. And I was raised by that guy. I was raised by the true example of what it looks like to be a servant leader and a salesperson in the world. I'm a musician at heart deep down inside. So an entertainer, if you will, at 17, I was signed to a record label, toured all over the world with a band on Pluto records. Then Warner brothers records, wow entertainment. And like creative side of me is what led me to sales and branding inside of sales, which was how I birthed what some people know as the copier warrior.
Speaker 2 00:02:56 I did that for about 14 years, highly successful, lots of fun, cool stuff could highlight at all, but don't care and nobody should anyway, right? It's not really about like what I've done. It's about what I'm doing and the legacy I'm leaving. And so those, those were billion was born just based off that thought two years now, we've been running TSR. We've got a whole bunch of coaches. Whole bunch of employees didn't think we'd get this far, but man, we love it. We lead from the perspective of people first, you know, over products, experiences over pitches, community over commission checks. And I can't wait to talk about our subjects today.
Speaker 1 00:03:29 Awesome brother. Hey, so I know you kind of touched on it, but I'm always curious because when I'm talking to individuals like yourself, because, and I don't mean this in a bad way, but there's a lot of people out there that are starting on demand in libraries, do a lot of things from a sales standpoint, you must've seen something like, Hey, we can do this better or something's missing. Like what made you kind of start T as our, you were highly successful in doing what you were doing. Just curious more than anything.
Speaker 2 00:03:53 Yeah. I think that there's a real big gap in the sales world right now in regards to what the gurus and the top dogs are teaching as opposed to what the salespeople of the 21st century need to be learning. Because I was in that world. I, I hired trainers. I hired him for my teams for myself. So I was in it. And so I just kind of watched this dismal performance by the sales training world and thought, man, we can really shake this up and more than anything, I think that what's taught in sales is, are the tricks and the tips and the moves and that we've gotten so far away from the basics and in regards to how we can become successful as salespeople. And that starts with servant leadership, mind you, that I just see such a gap there. Like there's so much to fill in between that state, that sentence and what it is that we're doing, that we have our work cut out for us. And we'll be doing this for many, many years because of it. That's
Speaker 1 00:04:46 Awesome, man. Hey, what's been the biggest challenge, biggest learning that you didn't either anticipate or maybe it was an epiphany or all the above.
Speaker 2 00:04:54 Yeah. Dude, every day is a learning lesson and like a section of your life, really like every moment you got to look at, not from the perspective of here I am in this moment and what am I going to do about it? But from the perspective of, I need to be intentional right now because in five years, 10 years, 15 years, it's really going to affect my outcomes. Long-term. So I would say that every single turn that I've been on so far has been something that's helped me to learn extensively, but the biggest learning lesson that I've had so far though, it shows building as we've built our community, which I feel like we've done a really good job. We've taken some of the playbooks from the best. And then also just from my own experience of doing it myself locally for so long. And, but really where we missed the mark is with our people.
Speaker 2 00:05:39 We definitely failed our people internally at a certain point at a young age, you know, when a company, which was good to learn. And it's not the most sexy thing to admit by any means, but I'm a very transparent, very raw person. I feel like when you can hit a stride like that and learn from something at the two and a half three-year, especially when your people are the most important thing to you, then it's massive. Right. But even those of us that are focused on nothing, but people still fail in that category. Right. And I think it's an important conversation to have because we strive every day to, to do the opposite of fail in those regards. But we have not done the best job over the years, but what re format and all that rebranding all that internally and rebuilding all of that internally. And it's been freaking awesome so far in regards to doing that. And, and again, it's that whole lesson. Have you learned it now act on it and make it work? Nope.
Speaker 1 00:06:28 I mean, I think that's all part of the journey as well. Right? I mean, learning, figuring out reiterating, and then, you know, hopefully being a better company, a better individual as a result of it. I think that's fantastic. I know you as a copier warrior. I do, but I always ask this question and I'm sure there's another sales job before the buff. There's not let me know. I always love to hear the origin stories of salespeople. Like I was selling knives door to door at one person sell mausoleums in Alabama. Like I heard some great sales, origin stories. It was the copy of your first stint in sales or was there something before that?
Speaker 2 00:07:01 Yeah, I'm not that cool. In regards to my sales life, I don't have the story of being like 14 and selling comic books in middle school. Like it's not who I was. I was, I was a community builder for me. It was like all the skateboarding groups, all the punk rock cliques. Like I was in those, but I was also a leader in those. And that was kind of my sales experience as a kid. But at 17, my first job was with Barneys coffee. And prior to that, I worked landscaping and then my whole life, I grew up in my father's business and he sold copiers. So I learned business industry and all the concepts around it from a very young age. I did hard labor for the first couple of years of my walk. But then even when I was selling copiers, I had two other jobs.
Speaker 2 00:07:42 So I was selling copiers and I was also bartending at a wedding venue and then bar backing at an actual nightclub. And, and so I was working like 24 hours a day and it was intense, but the best times were when I was a musician. That's when I really learned how to sell. I spent five years doing that like full time and nothing else. And man, it was, again, it was like one of the best experiences of my life. And I learned to sell in those moments, but really technically in the B2B space copiers 14 years. And then Don
Speaker 1 00:08:11 Man. No, that's great, man. Hey man, before we hop into the topic, one question on that note, because I think back to my origin days and where I started not too dissimilar from copiers, I started the uniform sales at Cintas. So that was kind of my foray more in the industry. I did Rollins truck leasing as well, but Cintas kind of remind me of that cop. A lot of cold calling dial for dollars, all that fun stuff. What is your thoughts on you did that for a long time. What has been the biggest change in sales? Like when you started doing that? Like there was no social selling back then. I mean maybe there was some integration you did cause you were great at branding, but like what's been the biggest from a philosophy standpoint that you've seen shift in sales. Since that part,
Speaker 2 00:08:53 This is a good question, right? I mean 2016 to 2021, every single like quarter something changed sales. Right. Literally. And I think, I think what's interesting about that is like, there are people that capitalize on that kind of information and they do things like write a book about virtual selling in the middle of a pandemic, right? Like isn't, that's not a cash grab. And then there are people that really truly, they see what's going on and they want to help and serve. And so I think even though with all the shifts and all the changes, I think a lot of people have accentuated some of the changes because here we are post pandemic, not technically at right. Cause there's still, there's still some ways to go before we're back to quote unquote normal, but here we are. And that post pandemic world and the majority of people are back to a quote unquote normal lifestyle in regards to how you would sell to them from a B2B perspective.
Speaker 2 00:09:42 Even the people that are at home, right? This is a myth, in my opinion, even the people that are at home can still get things like a letter that you send them in the mail to their office address, right? Because they've enacted this cool thing called mail forwarding, which has always been available on either you have a courier service or you use the post office to do it right. And you can send all that mail right to your home and nobody will ever have your address, ladies and gentlemen. So there's all these little things that people have been lied to about, in my opinion, as well too, through the process, like you could only get on LinkedIn now, or you can only do email or don't call anybody because nobody has a phone in their house, in their house, right? I mean, it's just this again, there's this, these shifts and changes, but there's this pandemic of its own of people just trying to take advantage of sellers in a short window to try and make 9 99 off of each, every, and every single one of you and a one-time purchase to get you, to buy their course and learn about their thing.
Speaker 2 00:10:32 And really the only thing that truly has shifted is just the opportunities to be able to take advantage of the outlets and mediums to get in touch with people or to build relationships or to create community. That's it, that's the only thing that's really changed sales at its core has always been this one thing, which is servant leadership. And if you have that mindset, if you're looking to do more than just transactional sales with people, then you'll win every single day because you'll be making impact, you'll be causing curiosity. You'll be creating something much bigger than what a buyer is typically used to and you'll win.
Speaker 1 00:11:05 Yeah. You've brought this up a couple of times, so I want to make sure maybe you can help define it. You say servant leadership. When you say that kind of what your thought process, what does that philosophy when you say that?
Speaker 2 00:11:14 Yeah, there's a simple way to put it, which is that a servant leader is the person that when the doors are closed is doing all the work that nobody will ever see or be able to recognize that person for the betters, the community around them. It's as simple as that. And that was my father, where there was one time ever, when somebody finally said, dude, you need to be recognized for what you've done. And they invited him to this big gala that they were going to put them up on stage in front of everybody. There's a thousand plus people that bought tickets already for our local community. And my dad said no way. And don't tell people about these things because that's not how I roll. And he was very grateful right? To those, to those folks. But man, I'll never forget it because they sent him a plaque and they told him in a note in the plaque that said, no one knows we made this for you with a Winky face, right?
Speaker 2 00:11:58 Like how I thought that was hilarious, but it's that much of an impact on people that you can have as a servant leader that really changes the game and the landscape of the way that you again are creating that success. Because over time your reputation will precede itself, no matter what you did behind those closed doors, someone will know it was you. At one point, I've done it in my walk to where people have just gotten. There's no other person that would have known about this or done this except for this guy, Dale. And, and that's a crazy thought to think that Dale just did this for me, but you know, maybe you get a text in the middle of the night or an email saying, just saying, thank you. Like I know it was you kind of thing and you acknowledge it or not, but that's not the point.
Speaker 2 00:12:35 Again, the point is, is that we have a very short window on the surf and salespeople have a unique opportunity to be able to impact lives, change lives for the betterment of society and culture and community. And yet all we do is focus on the transaction more so than anything. So servant leadership goes back to the idea of that. If your buyer needs it, then sure you can sell it to them, but you're not really selling anything. You're letting them buy. You're letting them have this opportunity to be able to create difference for themselves. And you're just facilitating that in the first place, which is what the definition of that word. That's
Speaker 1 00:13:05 Fantastic, man. You know, I remember an old mentor of mine used to say, sales should always be a win-win right? You should win. The customer should definitely win. And the old adage of sales is win at any cost. And whether it's for the customer or not just getting that commission, getting that sale, I think that has been somewhat of a shift from a sales perspective. I liked that servant leadership. So let's jump into it because this guy, she sparked a dialogue. I actually reached out to you because I saw something on LinkedIn. You had a great post around sales, objections and sales objections. That's also something that has kind of looked different over a period of time, how sales objections are handled, how they're looked at. So I want to dig into, and, and I want you to actually, this may sound contrite. It may sound really boil down. When we're talking about sales objectives, how do you actually define sales objections? Like when you're thinking of a sales objection, how do you define it, Dale? There's a couple of
Speaker 2 00:13:58 Things that I would say to this. I'll make it brief, but because they're big thoughts, but the first one is, is that an objection? Isn't truly what we define it to be an objection is a buying signal. In most cases, the only time that an objection is truly the word objection is when somebody says, you're annoying me, go away. You did something I didn't ask you to do. Please leave the pharmacist, right? Like that's an object, a real objection. Everything else is really literally just a buying signal or it is a clairvoyant moment for you to recognize and understand that you have not done a very good job at articulating who you are and what you do to this person. So for example, because a lot of people will say, when I say those last two things, they'll say, yeah, well what about an a cold call?
Speaker 2 00:14:39 There's plenty of objective. Well, of course there is that's because nobody does cold calls correctly. These days, in my opinion, right? All you gotta do is put a little bit of extra effort in behind it or changed the mentality of your quote unquote talk track to less, Hey, uh, if I could do this for you, would you give me 30 minutes, you know, to meet with you next week, like stop trying to sell at people and start getting to know them better start causing curiosity, start creating something that's much different than what salespeople are doing by interrupting patterns, by creating a radical education moment for people. And by doing those things, objections kind of fade away in the first place. But this is the idea, all of this leads back to the idea of proactive selling. If, if I sat back and I said, all right, what are the 10 things that people tell me that are quote-unquote objections.
Speaker 2 00:15:22 If I wrote those down, would my talk track change or what I just said in mediocrity and continue to be stale and the way I deliver it. Right? Right. So, but the thought being for rebels is, is that when we look at those top 10 objections, maybe there are only two, maybe there's 50. I don't know. Right? Like it's depends on your industry and what you hear, but most of them can be boiled down to one problem, right. Or two problems. They really can. So if I look at that, how do I be proactive? How do I tell somebody before they hang up on me and say, they're not interested that, Hey, I know you're not interested. Right? Like how do I do that in a way that's proactive that helps somebody to, to think this person gets it right? How do I cause familiarity, even in that moment of an objection to where someone says, yeah, I was actually thinking that it's interesting.
Speaker 2 00:16:02 You bring it up though. And now I'm curious to hear more, right? It's not deflecting or diverting either. It's like literally running head on into the store. I'm like the Buffalo and saying like, yeah, I'm going to take this on. And if it, if it's not the right fit, I'll find out the best way possible. Instead of beating around the Bush or having somebody tell me in a weak moment. Sure. I'm interested. And then a day later canceling my appointment with them. Right. So, so proactive selling, I think, is what really, truly helps to better define what an objection is in the first place, because we understand it when we write it down and we look at it and we see when it comes in the conversation, we go, oh, well, hell I should be saying this way before I hear it in the first place. Right. Once we've created that aha moment for ourselves, there's no such thing as an objection anymore.
Speaker 1 00:16:46 That's a great top track. So let me help me understand that Dale so agree or disagree here. So along the entire set, like it used to be, I remember the days of old selling is you heard objections when you were closing, like always be closing. There was a closing and then you get your objections. Right. And that philosophy is so antiquated in my mind. And I think you would maybe agree, but really the objections, like you said, not really objections or talking points or opportunities that should really be happening throughout. So when you actually get to the close, those things have been topped out, flushed out proactively. So now it becomes a matter of whatever it becomes from a closing standpoint. Agree, disagree, my art, my tracking on the same path as you.
Speaker 2 00:17:27 Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Cause I think objections did technically they started a majority of them start, I should say with the close. Right. Whereas prior to a lot of people will, especially back in the early days of modern selling that people would say, oh, I'm interested in this. Cause I've never heard of it. Or it might, it might be interesting to me. So they would, they would the pitch and they would set the appointment and really where the objections came in was during the close. Well now I think that people are so knowledge capable through Google, you know, uh, let alone anything else that they are using to gain that knowledge of society, of the world of technology, whatever it is that they're learning about that when they hear from you and you say, yeah, I'm with this gum with a T and T right.
Speaker 2 00:18:10 They think, okay, great. Well, I don't need you. I don't want you. You're just one of the five I've got my own. I've dealt with you before in the past, there's a lot more objections that happen with people in the year, 2021 in the midst of listening to you speak or me speak. Because again, people are very, they're proactively learning industries and understanding what happens in those things where prior to it was more or less like, what is this? What's a copier, right? Oh my gosh. I've heard about one of those. Like what? I don't know anything about it. I'd like to learn more and then you go through the dog and pony show and then it's like, oh, $30,000. I'm sorry. I don't, I'm not interested in that's where the sales gurus have come in and said here's 5,000 ways to get past an objection.
Speaker 2 00:18:49 And again, I think that even in that moment of understanding that an objection can be tackled proactively that you can literally be prepared for it in the middle of the close. And you can be proactively talking about it before you ever get there in the first place, the salespeople don't like to talk about things that might weigh with a heavy response or negative response. Right. They don't like to talk about those things because they would rather just hear yes. And they'd rather fight all the way to a yes. Instead of just laying down and saying, it's okay, if this isn't the right fit for you in the first place, there's a mentality and a mindset that has to shift for most sellers because of that. But when I unlocked it, I mean, it was way easier for me to sell deals way more productive in my time, especially because I wasn't getting jerked around.
Speaker 2 00:19:32 It's like having somebody to come, come look at your house and say, well, I'd like to put an offer on, but I want these couple of things done. Well, meanwhile, 50 other people will put a freaking offer on your house. And you're just like, okay, well, these ones didn't say any of that. So I'm going to go with one of them. Right? We got to think bigger about these perspectives in the year 2021. I feel like we box sales in too often. And we've done it as a, as a society, more than anything where you hear sales and you think of specific things, peculiar things, things you don't like, things, things that you're disengaged with, right. It's a dirty word in most cases. And so the word objections inside of sales is also a dirty word. Well, seller's got to learn to embrace them and be extremely proactive around them or they're never going to get better.
Speaker 1 00:20:14 I think you led right down the path to my next question. And obviously it's a loaded question because I know the answer to it, but objections can either be seen positively or they could be seeing negatively. Right? I mean, it depends on what your viewpoint of it is. If you're approaching it as you are, they're actually positive buying signals that you should be approaching proactively. Do you agree with that deal? In my own? Okay. Yeah. I totally agree. When you talk to a sales rep, especially younger sales reps, you can almost sense the fear when they hear an object, like an objection to them was like the, oh my God, how do I do? Where did they shift? Like if it is actually positive, how did it make the turn? Or where did that shift happen? Why all of a sudden are people actually getting all nervous, flustered, whatever the case might be.
Speaker 2 00:20:57 Yeah. I think that this goes back to the identity of which a lot of people don't like to go toward or talk about in the first place, the identity of how you were raised, what your lifestyle looks like leading up to getting in sales. What you've been cultured to understand about life in the first place. One of the things is, is that we're told no a lot as kids, for example, and we're told by our parents. And so when someone says something to us, like I'm not interested, we can flash back to that trauma and, or slash you know, that way that we've been raised. Cause it's not always negative. It's just that it has a negative impact on us to some capacity. We fear objections just because of the fact of the matter that we sit back. And we think about the repercussions of that type of negativity on our life.
Speaker 2 00:21:41 Right? We think about, oh man, well, this feels like I'm doing something bad. This feels like I'm wasting someone's time. This feels like this. Isn't a yes. And so I didn't get that dopamine rush and I don't feel good about this. And so I don't want anything to do with this. Why a lot of people get out of sales almost immediately because they think, well, that sucked. Well, I love the idea of thinking about like getting the best deal you ever had. Right. Getting a better, no, that's what the rebellion was founded on that back in 2010, when I first started creating some of these concepts, when I was still a seller of being proactive and causing so much of a stir in someone's heart and mind, then by the time you got to a place where it was going to be a no, that it was really difficult for them to give it to you in the first place.
Speaker 2 00:22:22 And because of that, you started to create lots of transparency. And I did in my sales walk, I should say. And that transparency turned into moments of pure bliss for me as a seller, because I would get in the car and think, man, it's crazy that I lost that sale. And I walked out with two referrals or it's crazy that I lost that sale, but I, I feel like I'm gonna win it in a year or so. I got a weird feeling the first couple of times, but when it started coming to fruition, that's when I started to sit back and recognize that, wow, like this is actually a good thing that I should be searching toward. Now here's the other side though, is that I was never cultured. Like I was told that no is okay. Right. That's what I was always told. So when someone said I'm not interested or no, I was told it was okay. And so it was, if I challenged you, if I was like, what do you mean? Can you help me understand that better? Then it sounded different because I wasn't going, oh yeah, I totally understand. Hey, one thing before I let you off it, wasn't it didn't sound disingenuous. Didn't sound like I'm ready for a trip. I would simply stay. Cool. So tell me what you mean by that
Speaker 1 00:23:26 Curiosity. They're like, it was a genuine curiosity, right?
Speaker 2 00:23:29 And that would again go back to the identity of like, how were you raised and what is it that's holding you back from the negativity of the objection? Like what is so negative about it in the first place? So sitting back and really analyzing those things is extremely important and we don't do it enough. We truly don't. So I think that literally fix the way that we look at objections, the way we look at negativity with just a slight mindset shift of understanding that number one, we can get a better know if we communicate differently, but number two, it's really it's okay that somebody doesn't want to buy your stuff or they're not interested right now. Like that's just as to me challenge accepted and I'll stay in touch for the next three years. No other rep will, they'll all be fired or go to another company or get sick and sales. And that's the way that it was when I was in my industry. The only people that stuck around where the liars, the cheats and the, and the thieves and because of that, they had bad reputations. And so it was real simple for me to just consistently win because of it. So,
Speaker 1 00:24:24 Hey, so kind of going down that same kind of rabbit hole for a bit, for me, I always found objections. I know we're trying to change the connotation of an objection, but I always found when they got late, when they got later in the deal, it can be clearly tracked back to something I didn't do early in the process. I didn't qualify. I didn't do the blocking and tackling as a salesperson. I can always tie it back. That's what I always said. Okay. But it's a learning experience to your point. Okay. Well next time around. You're not perfect, everyone, you know, no, one's got a 100% batting average.
Speaker 2 00:24:59 I agree with everything you're saying, like, I look at, I look at the identity objection, as a chance to learn what you're doing wrong in your process. For sure. And I believe that that's what really helps me to, to truly understand what it was specifically that I needed to change in my process. So like for example, when I would drop into somebody's office and this is one of my more like 2016, 2017 marketing pieces, but I used to have these for those that can't see, I'll describe it in a second, but is to have these like eight and a half by 11 size or poster size 11 by 17 framed sometimes. But it's an image of me fighting a coffee machine, like I'm in a video game, like street fighter or mortal combat. And imagine that I'm walking in and dropping that off as my first impression with you instead of this, you know, generic business card that looks like everybody else's and has my number and my fax and my address, like who cares about all that information anyway.
Speaker 2 00:25:58 And really you're just going into a quote unquote tickler file as they used to call it where you would just be put in and launched with all the other sales people like, ah, maybe we'll need you one day, right? Like what is that in the first place? So I started to recognize it and the objections I was getting such as we have somebody, but we'll hold onto your information. Like, well, how do you beat that? How do you cause such an emotional stern people in a moment to make them question their 20 year relationship and not because you're trying to create this loyalty, but because you're trying to open up the flood gates around, what's really happening inside of the ecosystem that they've created and why they're truly miserable, but they just decided to stay in that same insanity because it's easier in the first place.
Speaker 2 00:26:38 So I know they got a little deep, but the more that I sat back and kind of recognize that as part of my, the crazier, the outcomes would become where even I would hear from presidents of companies that would say, I would love to do something with you just because of your marketing, but I can't disrupt the status quo and shake the apple tree right now, my organization, but stay in touch. Yeah. Imagine that no, from a guy like that, that runs an $800 million company in your backyard, you know, that you've been told is untouchable and you could never get in front of, in the first place. Right? Those are the kinds of things that when we start to seek out that type of rejection in the first place, try to get a no from those types of people, trying to get an objection from those types of people, but do it proactively knowing that your process is going to be evolving and changing and tackling against those objections to begin with. And you'll be successful no matter what you'll be successful.
Speaker 1 00:27:29 I like that, man. It's almost too. I think you said the term almost seeking it out, seeking out the objection. That's a great way of verbalizing it. I remember a long time ago and you're right. You brought this up earlier, you know, you probably boiled down all these objections, if you will, budget, timing, urgency, authority, all that fun stuff. But I had an old mentor many moons ago who told me really there's really only one objection in his, his thought processes. That status quo, whatever they do, like status goes the biggest objection you're ever going to hear, like, I'm doing this now. It's because of this. Like whatever you're doing, no one likes to change. Like that's what you got to get your arms around. I don't know if that's shifted or not, but I've always found that to be true. That's usually what you're fighting up against.
Speaker 1 00:28:12 I'm happy with my competitor because it's status quo and I'm happy doing this because I've always done it that way. So it's funny that you bring those types of things up. So how should we be approaching it? Like I remember in the posts, you brought up, take a deep breath first and foremost, take a deep breath. That sounds very basic. But walk us through, like, what should the approach be? How do you recommend that when you're training sales reps? And I hate to say objections again, but around that type of top track, what's your recommendations?
Speaker 2 00:28:42 The number one thing is to just like cool out, like for a second, like just chill, you know, don't take things so personally, because, and I'm not saying to separate business from your personal life, right. I'm just saying that like people aren't trying to hurt you in that moment, you're building falsity by thinking that in the first place and you're going to cause your sales walk to be very tough in those moments. You know? So sitting back and instead being very like taking everything, even when people are rude and nasty, taking all those moments as constructive in the moment and say, okay, so here's what happened. This is the type of person that I feel that they were, you know, because you don't want to judge people, but also the more that you do with certain folks, like here's their title inside of their organization.
Speaker 2 00:29:27 Here's the type of vertical that they're in. When you start to break all that information down, you can start to recognize that, wow, when I call into the construction world, I get a lot more F-bombs. And when I call into the medical world, those are the types of things that truly help us be better at what we're doing. But, but no matter what to never say, like I should have said something different when they said that, no, just stop. Just stop telling yourself that. Stop going back to the moments, like move the heck on like it's time for the next and it's time for you to remember what happened, but change the trajectory of the outcome. And you do that by very simply saying, I think I got there because of this and proactively changing steps inside of your process because of the objection you got.
Speaker 2 00:30:12 So proactively engaging those objections really, truly, this is what it just keeps coming back to for me, no matter what, and it's how we train rebels. Right? So again, there's a little things you can do in the moments, but just pull out a journal, write down what happened, especially if you're busy and you can't make a change in the moment, right? Like I'm a guy that can change everything. You could just say, usually at one thing and I'll freaking change, I'll change it. Right. And I will never forget when, when I first started taking sales training, when my coach said, Hey, I'm going to ask you to do stuff you've never done before. Are you okay with that? And I just laughed at him. Like you don't even know me, bro. Bring it on. Like, try to get me uncomfortable, try to get me to do something that I don't want to do in the first place. Cause I'll try anything and everything, as long as it doesn't harm, you know, myself or somebody else at the end of the day is always the thought around it. So for me, that comes back to that principle of servant leadership. And then again, the principle of being super proactive inside of your sales walk with all things. No,
Speaker 1 00:31:07 I think you're right. I mean, I like the journal idea, you know, obviously in today's day and age with the gongs, the courses, the <inaudible>, all these call conversation, analytic tools out there. There's really not a reason why as a sales rep, you shouldn't be listening back to that call in, in documenting. Okay. Where did that go off to your point? Like w what can we do in the moment? How could I have improved and making those adjustments? So I think that's another thing. And you know what, I gotta be honest with you. I think that's an area even as sales leaders, you know, I find myself, you need to lean on those tools to help equip your team to help equip itself as well. One of the things I always used to hear one of my mentors in the past, he used to say, and this is old school thinking maybe, but he used to always say, empathize, clarify, isolate, and respond.
Speaker 1 00:31:55 Right. You know, they'll empathy. Hey, I understand where you're coming from. Clarify, did I hear this correctly? Isolate? Is that the only thing? And then respond back to once again, keep moving the deal forward. And it is older school, but I have found if you've gotten yourself in that situation, if you've gotten yourself to a point where, Hey, I didn't do that early on in the process, how do I recover from it? I think there are not tricks because there are all these assumptive closes and all this other crap out there, these tricks, that's just a technique to help understand what the buyers actually tell. Cause you, you said it earlier, we need to peel back the young, like I'm curious why? No, like just help me understand a little bit more. That's really what you should be doing in that conversation right now is just having a natural curiosity. Right, right.
Speaker 2 00:32:42 Yeah. And there's empathy in that too. And that, because I think the thing that the old school tactic missed on the empathy plays that when you say something like I understand and you don't in your life. And I think it's important too, to recognize that I just I'm a straight shooter and I love real talk. And so for me, like I recognize that kind of stuff. And I don't say, oh, the people that didn't do that or did that once are bad. I just say, again, this is where the sales rebellion has filled a gap and why we exist in the first place. So you've got to remember that people have been selling just fine leading up to today, right? People have been using all kinds of terrible, terrible techniques and absolutely atrocious moves and tactics and strategies and winning business. Right. Even when it, even when it hurts their reputation a little bit too, they still continue to win business.
Speaker 2 00:33:35 So there's no denying things like that. And that's a real point to make as well too, because again, it's the decision of how do you want to feel at the end of the day? And also, how do you want your community to remember you? Are you going to show up at a place where people are like, yeah, that guy sold me something once and he sucks. Right. Are you going to show up somewhere where people are going to go, man, I really enjoyed the experience I had with you. I really liked your culture. I really liked what it was that you brought to the table. And I, I appreciate the enjoyable experience you gave me, even though I didn't buy anything from you or even, even when I spent 20 years buying from you, I never really can think of anything that you did that caused me strive for anger, you know, in those, in those moments.
Speaker 2 00:34:14 So again, I think it's this bigger picture perspective of how do we, how do we look at a lot of the things that have worked in the past and also understand what's missing there? What are the gaps? So the true empathy of saying, well, help me understand that. I'd love to, I would really love to understand that because I don't right now that's raw honesty and a format of empathy and that you you're trying to put yourself out there to better understand where this person is coming from. So the, you know, how to treat them moving forward, which is the biggest picture that I can give around relationship selling as well, which is what I truly believe in. If you can't build a relationship with somebody, that's okay. If you want it to just be a commodity transaction. And that moment that works, but always strive to build a relationship with anybody and everybody, every relationship doesn't mean that you've got to show up every Friday with pizza for the kids, right?
Speaker 2 00:35:04 Our relationship has just something where you, a person looks at you from the perspective of integrity, honesty, and also what you have as a best interest in mind. Right? Is it them right? Is it their company, right? Or is it your product? Is it your bottom line? Is your, why is it your wallet? Right. And that all those things I'll show and things like negotiations, right? When we tell people like, well, what can you do for, I'll do this for you, but what can you do for me? You know, things like that. Like all the little tricks inside of those things. Why not just sit with somebody in the middle of a negotiation, not to get sidetracked here and say, I mean, everything you're asking for sucks because I'm going to have to go and get permission for all this stuff. I'm going to lose money. And I don't really know that I win anything out of this, you know, but you win everything and that, so what could we do here? You know, I mean, that's a great way to start a negotiation with somebody. And I did it multiple times in my career.
Speaker 1 00:35:54 Thousands. You were being real in that moment that wasn't a facade. Like you weren't like putting on an act like I'm going to be, here's my sales pitch. Like that was surely you saying, Hey, this doesn't sound you a great deal to me. I mean everything.
Speaker 2 00:36:07 Right? Cause I freaking mean it bro. Cause, cause I wanna see, I want to have a good relationship with you myself. I want the best for you and your company in the first place. And if I go back to my Oregon and make them promise all these things, they're going to, Hey, they're going to freaking hate me and tell me no to most of it. And then I'm going to just come back here and disobeying them because I noticed the only thing that's going to get this deal, or I'm going to stand up in that moment and say, I'm not going to do it, which was 99% of the time for me. And which led to them coming back and buying something at the end of the day. Right? Because that's an abundance mindset and not a scarcity mindset. Right. But again, I'm just speaking out loud what most sales people struggle with and suffer from, to begin with and how really it's just small stuff like that.
Speaker 2 00:36:50 Right? Because that's an objection during negotiation, you know, in my opinion, when someone asks for a bunch of stuff that you aren't going to give them in the first place and they know it, they know it. And so they're going to squeeze it out of you, right? Like those are all things that, again, tied back to the relationship, tied back to the transparency type, back to this idea of being audacious, empathetic, being radical and the way that we educate people, being curious and the way that we drive conversations, there are solid ingredients around the concept that are very baseline in regards to human emotion. And just like what happens, you know, with a human, when we're speaking to them in regards to what they think, what they feel in regards to what objection they give us right in the first place. So it, it all ties together, but it all starts in this, you know, this one ingredient, right? And then from there you make your own sauce. You decide the best way to make it work for you. But when you understand the base components of what an objection is and why you're getting it, because there's only one answer, right? Like I said, it was one, maybe two answers in most cases, when you can understand that, answer that one or that, or those two answers, then you're at the foundational level of why you're getting an objection in the first place. And you can fix it easier because you can recognize the, yeah,
Speaker 1 00:38:06 That's a great call out. And one of the things, as you're saying that Dale and we're going to start wrapping up here is it's funny when you get those, there's the ebbs and flows of a sales call, sales meeting, whatever you want to call it and interaction with the customer where you have a definitive choice, right? You have a choice of talking to them like a human being, being organic, being real, talking to them in a manner that will probably resonate with them on a human level or kind of that. But that light switch flips and you become the Salesforce. Like everything that you've been taught, or I should say this, this is how I handle this objection. And you become, I do understand where you're coming from, but if I could do this and do that, I don't know if that's the lizard brain in us or what that is.
Speaker 1 00:38:49 But there seems to be that trigger in a lot of salespeople. And that's really the demise of most opportunities. We kind of flipped to that. And we automatically go to that. Agree with that. Or am I off things a little bit? I absolutely agree with that. Yeah. So we've talked about a lot, man. How do you boil this down? Final thoughts for the audience? Are you talking about objections? I, you said, Hey Sam, it's really simple, man. I keep going back to this one thing, but what are some final thoughts? Tips, techniques, feedback, whatever the case might be bail for the audience.
Speaker 2 00:39:18 Yeah. I mean, just remember to be proactive in your sales walk. If you haven't been proactive in this part of your sales walk, start getting proactive, remember it at the core of fixing, this is your attitude and the action of being proactive. That's the bottom line. Simple as that now seeking advice, having others help you go to your boss, go to your manager, head to one of your coworkers, seek out a sales trainer, a guru on the internet, find all their content, whatever. Like if you need to dive deeper into it and understand it on more of a granular level as you go. So be it right, but really start with this identity of the simplicity of what's really happening in those moments and how to beat it, which is go to the core foundation of who you are proactively in those moments. Why am I in sales?
Speaker 2 00:40:07 Why is this person listening to my pitch in the first place? Why does my product help this person's company? When we start to be proactive around these foundational concepts as well too, while we're understanding that objection, we really reinforce what it is that we're doing. We get more fired up about it. We changed the way we think we changed the way we communicate and all of those things. It's like a tumbleweed, right? Or a snowball effect. I is probably the better way to look at it where it just gets bigger and bigger and bigger over time until find a good way until suddenly there is no objection. And even when there is one again, you're doing everything exactly the way it needs to be delivered to this person. And because of that, it's coming up as the best know that you ever got.
Speaker 1 00:40:48 That's great, man. You know, it's funny you bring that up because as you're talking about being proactive and you remember, I remember your story about the copier where she said, oh, it's $30,000. I'm out or whatever. She said, you probably learned from that, Hey, I may need to address those things sooner. And that like, avoid like not avoid, I need to address that much sooner than the end. I've just wasted six months of my life trying to close this deal only to hear it. Something that's probably new is going to be an objection to begin with or an opportunity. But you probably adapt to that. Right? You probably made adjustments to your process fair or unfair.
Speaker 2 00:41:21 Hey, typically when I'm using, when I'm dealing with a vertical like yours and speaking to someone in your position, the machines are way too expensive. And I only bring that up because I just want to make sure that we're on the same page before we get started. Is price going to be an issue? And are you even in any kind of knowledge currently as to what a commercial copier costs,
Speaker 1 00:41:41 What call is? I mean, is that like the first or second? Like, that's not like the 25th call. Like that's the first call, right? That's proactive. Right. You're heading off what, you know, you're going to get any way that might be a risk and actually disqualify. And they may say, yeah, it's 30 grand. I can't do this. Great. I learned that after one call versus the 25th. Right?
Speaker 2 00:42:00 Yeah. And you do that after somebody says, I'm really interested, right? Let's let's do this. I really want to set an appointment. I'm really interested. You tackle all those objections in the middle of, instead of going great, how's the 30th, right? Instead you say, cool, let's check a few boxes real quick so that we can be very, I can be very pulling it in and the time that I take with you and then also that we don't waste any of either of our time. So here's some things I wanted to bring up. Right. I mean, there's a very cool postured and intellectual way to do this. That also is just hits the fields perfectly, which is what people buy from emotions. Yep. So,
Speaker 1 00:42:38 So, Hey Dale, how do people connect with you? How they learn a little bit more about the sales rebellion. Give us those times.
Speaker 2 00:42:46 Cool man. Yeah. I'm on all social sites. You can find me on LinkedIn. The easiest because I post content daily on there. Dale Dupree, like it sounds or linkedin.com backslash backslash copier warrior at sales rebellion on every other social site. I'm on tic-tac Twitter, Instagram, YouTube, you name it. I'm working them all. If you want to head to the website, sales rebellion, DeSales rebellion.com. You can join our free slack group under the community tab. We've got an awesome new app called refuge, the rebel refuge. If you'd like to learn more about it, you can head to any of my sites, any of my pages on my bio's on my feature sections have a link back to learn more it's games for salespeople basically, but daily. So it's a, it's a lot of fun. We're excited about its release and hope to see a lot of room rebels, jump into it and enjoy it with us inside of the community that we're building. So that's
Speaker 1 00:43:34 Awesome, man. And we're going to include those links in the show notes. So everyone they're going to remember for Dale, the congrats man on your success, man, I am truly happy for you and thanks again for coming on the show shutter day. Thanks Sam. Appreciate you.
Speaker 0 00:43:49 Thank you for listening to the sales samurai podcast with your host, Sam Capra. Be sure you subscribe to our podcast and visit sales <inaudible> dot IO and join the conversation. Access show notes and discover bonus content.
Founder & CEO @ The Sales Rebellion
Dale Dupree was once known as The Copier Warrior and is the appointed Leader and Founder of The Sales Rebellion. He is born and raised in Orlando, FL. Has a sales background that dates back to his childhood as he was raised wandering the halls of his father's business but has been a full-time sales professional for 13+ years. Founded on March 1st of 2019, Dale now provides sales training and development through his firm, The Sales Rebellion, that challenges the status quo. He is audacious with his outreach, intentional in his sales walk, and driven to create a community of sales professionals that cause undeniable curiosity and true impact in their walk with prospects and clients alike by teaching the masses how to choose legendary in their sales career. The Rebellion believes in people over products, community over commission checks, fellowship over negotiations and experiences over performing a pitch.